Vidjagame Apocalypse 21 – The Passion of the X

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This week’s Vidjagame Apocalypse starts out innocuously enough, with a look at movies based on fake games, but things get heated in the second half, when the crew debates the merits of Microsoft’s decision to roll back its digital rights management plans for the Xbox One. Oh, and in between there’s some talk about Deadpool, Project X Zone and other games that actually exist for consoles that are currently available.

Question of the Week

Have the revelations about features being cut from the Xbox One changed your opinion about Microsoft’s initial DRM-for-discs plan? (And if not, has the reversal changed your opinion about the Xbox One?)

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Theme song by Matthew Joseph Payne. Break song is Sugar Rush by AKB48.

61 thoughts on “Vidjagame Apocalypse 21 – The Passion of the X

  1. QOTW – Still more expensive, Still more camera, Still more worse graphics, Still more lack of exclusives down the line, Still more better use of my time to stick to my PC.

  2. I’ve gone from not even considering XBONE to being likely to grab one. I’m a fan of 360 and fully expected to get a NeXtbox until the crushing policies were revealed. I preordered a PS4 when Italy offered on Amazon (have a day one delivery pre-order) and now I’m debating whether I get both or just PS4. I still feel a bit burned and cautious regarding XBONE and as I don’t particularly care about anything exclusive to it I may just plop down $400 and be happy with a shiny new PlayStation.

  3. QOTW: First of, Microsoft really did do this to themselves. Clearly Microsoft wanted to be the console equivalent of Steam (which does sound pretty cool), but all I ever really heard from them before it’s too late were “online check-ins” and “no used games”. But, there is a reason Steam has benefits such as crazy insane deals: competition. Steam’s digital download competition has grown in the past several years, on top of having to compete with the crazy rates of piracy on PC. This competition is why Steam ends up being so good. If Microsoft did go through with their attempt to be the Steam of consoles: what competition would they have? Does Microsoft have a near 90% piracy rate to compete with? Will PSN really be enough to drive Microsoft towards crazy discounts? What incentive would Microsoft have to actually BE the Steam of consoles?

    1. Also my opinion on this issue probably doesn’t matter since i’m poor and live in the middle of podunk nowhere and wont be getting either of these upcoming console ’till five years from now

  4. Nope. People now seem to attribute those DRM policies to the second coming of gaming’s Christ. If Christ were money-grubbing publishers, that is. Even if the policies were a good idea, I still wouldn’t trust them to the company that brought us crap like Windows ME, Vista, 8, GFWL and Xbox Live.

    Oh, and a response to my racial colleague from last-last week. Don’t lay off the cynicism. Hearing nothing but praise for a game on the internet can get grating, and misleading. I like hearing both sides of the argument, and pointing out a game’s flaws is more difficult(and fun) than just praising it. And I just like listening Grimm’s smooth, sensual voice

  5. QOTW-
    Microsoft: Here are our plans for the future
    (pulls out slavery chains and cuffs)
    -er oh what? you dont like that …tyrannical?….so what?….well we need it for money….uh..oh your all not gonna buy it?!!!…… oh …..well never mind
    Pretend this didnt happen, we never had any intention enslaving our customers and treating them as such.

    Microsoft revealed their hand, and with some of the worst pr ever, made them look like a evil company that I no longer wish to support.
    And Im not even sure now what separates xbox One with 360 now, that ps4 is going to do probably better.

  6. It HAS changed my opinion of the Xbone slightly for the better. At least now it’s a system that I COULD consider buying if it ever got enough great exclusive games I couldn’t play anywhere else. But as it stands, I probably still go for the PS4.

    Besides, they may have reversed their stance, but the PR damage has been done, and all the shit Phil Spencer and Don Mattrick have spouted against consumers cannot be forgotten.

  7. QOTW: Personally, the DRM was never my main issue with Microsoft. In fact, my guess is in 3-5 years both systems will be much more identical to Steam in terms of the number of people buying games digitally. At that point, used games will be a non-issue.

    My issue with the Xbox One is the lack of support for indie developers on the system. As someone who finds far more joy in the smaller and more creative projects from the indie scene, I was disappointed by Microsoft’s policies regarding self-publishing. Sony allowing dev’s to self-publish is what sold me on the PS4. I like the idea of getting experiences like Don’t Starve and Galak-Z on the same platform as Destiny and Metal Gear Solid 5. If Microsoft were to take it one step further and treat indie developers like Sony is, I may jump ship simply due to how glorious Capy game’s Below looks.

  8. QOTW – Given that all XB1 games will supposedly be available digitally, my opinion is this.

    (feel free to read this in a funny voice. Ooh, do the Red Letter Media guy)

    Microsoft should just use two completely separate policies. For people who buy the game on a physical disc, there’s no DRM. There’s no online check. You can sell it, trade it, whatever you want to do with the disc. But because of this, you don’t benefit from the plusses. You’re family can’t play your copy without the disk, you can’t access the game from any system, etc.

    On the other hand, if you get the game digitally, ALL of this should apply to you. If you have the game digitally, you’re basically playing it like a Steambox. You have to be connected to the internet, but you get all of the neat new features that that connectivity affords you. You’ve already shown you don’t care about any of that physical stuff by not buying the physical disc, so it should basically be you just opting in to the future.

    By doing this, they also make the digital version more appealing to the people who AREN’T obsessed with owning a disc. Which is going to further push the market away from physical media, which is what MS want’s anyway.

    tl:dr – No DRM and no new online features for disc buyers. Yes DRM and new onine features for digital version buyers.

  9. QOTW: Their original controversial plans were just the extra reason not to buy one. When you line up their exclusives, console features and hardware revealed so far, nothing gave me an incentive. Even when they’ve done a U turn, all of the other reasons not to buy one still stand. If it’s on Xbox it will more than likely be on PC except with better graphics, at a reduced price, free online and mods and user made updates.

  10. QOTW. As a devout Playstation cry baby I was getting high from the schadenfreuden fumes coming off the Xbox shit pile, especially after all the fuck ups Sony committed soon after their launch. I expect Microsoft to turn it around (much like Sony) but not before it even came out.

    I don’t buy used anyways but enjoyed all the hate against it.

  11. It has not changed my opinion in that I won’t be buying a Xbox 180. I will get a PS4 when the new Infamous comes out next year because I love that franchise (not sold on any of the PS4 launch games atm)

  12. Hope Anne feels better! It sounded like she was really dying.

    I made the new releases jingle into more of a jingle…barely: http://pucomic.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/new_releases_jingle.mp3

    QOTW: Chris made some good points about the DRM! However my main problem with the XBone wasn’t the DRM, but the creepy camera that always watches me. I’ve no real problem with MS’s system in theory, but now they’ve backtracked there’s no way of knowing how well it would have worked out for the consumers any dang way. The benefits could have been disasters, the pitfalls could have been easily ignored – we’ll never know.

  13. I’m glad that Microsoft reversed their DRM policies with the Xbox One. I was willing to get one anyway, but the 24 hour check ins seemed a bit extreme. The PR fiasco and mixed messages from MS did not do the consoles any favors as well.

    I’m surprised at how quickly MS reversed their policies though; I thought for sure it would take at least a year for them to rethink their DRM.

  14. QOTW:

    Honestly, while the 180 (as everyone’s been pun’ing) was a really good decision on their part, I’m still not really interested in the Xbone. Price wise, its too much compared to the PS3 and Sony’s moves in general have just caught my attention much better, and made me actually want their next-gen system.

  15. Tell CMtista ElecTRONica is gone from California Adventure and is replaced by the Mad Tea Party. Arcade gone as well. It was pretty awesome for the time it was here. Nothing like getting drunk and tripping out at the Tron scenery at a Disney park.

    1. Did you know, they put a lot of those games back out for play in the Starcade at Disneyland! Plus they have the Fix it Felix Jr. games on freeplay.

      You’re right, ElecTronica was awesome! I missed your comment before I posted about it (below)

  16. QOTW – Kinda happy microsoft took down its DRM since there are people who don’t have a good enough internet connection to do a 24 hour daily check. Slightly sad about the no-disc game sharing but I’ll live on. Now microsoft really needs to drop that $100 dollar price difference, i know it comes from the kinnect the xbox is bundled with but right now is not the time to push the kinect down peoples throats.

  17. QOTW: I’m still anti-DRM. It has a massive amount of negatives, and the benefits Microsoft had for Xbox One were either never shown or were achievable without those restrictions. Family sharing was never proven to be anything more than a way for people to demo your games, so I don’t buy that it was going to let 10 people access your whole library anywhere, at anytime, for free. Being able to give a digital game to a friend once shouldn’t be dependent on blocking people without internet. The cloud will still be part of Xbox One, and there’s no reason certain games can’t require the cloud, without having the whole system be exclusive. You could argue doing that would block out XBO gamers who can’t get online, but XBO was already going to be doing that, so I’m not seeing the difference.

    There are many benefits to digital games, but after watching the way Microsoft operates for over 8 years, I believe those benefits would’ve been reaped by them, and not the consumer, which is why all they had to sell us on the DRM was a series of vague promises that we never saw.

  18. …Wow, the hypocrisy coming out of Chris Antista’s mouth is simply astounding. Hey guys, remember how this was the same guy who pretty much advocated piracy over PC DRM? And that kept shitting on PCs because DRM measures like that? Hope you do, because it’s obvious that guy doesn’t exist anymore.

    I don’t know if working for a publisher is what has genuinely transformed Antista into a corporate shill, but holy fuck. It can’t be a coincidence that now, every single time there’s a corporate move that seeks to grab cash or infringe on people’s consumer rights, Chris becomes an attack dog ready to jump right at their defense. First it was his defense of microstransactions, now this. Seriously, would the Chris that hosted TalkRadar would have ever talked like that?

    Not to mention: Yeah Chris, you DO sound like a fucking privileged douchebag when talking about. “well, i don’t buy physical media, I don’t buy used, my Internet rarely goes down, so fuck everyone else that does.” Well guess what? I DO buy physical media, I DO buy and sell sued games, and three months ago my Internet went out for a whole week. Not everyone gets to live in a privileged first world country city like you, some of us happen to live in shittier countries like Mexico or worse. So no, fuck you if you think your needs are what matter.

    Also, you and others keep talking about this fantastic magical power of the cloud… If it’s so fucking great, then where is it? where’s the proof that it will indeed work like that? show me a game, or a service that exemplifies it and uses it properly, and I’ll gladly shut up and accept I’m wrong. But seriously, first of all, this “power” of the cloud really does require you to be always online? And if it does, then why not make a much bigger deal out of it? if it really was as fantastic and you claim it is, and Microsoft would have been able to do it with it’s original DRM methods, wouldn’t have been in their best interest to expose the shit out of that?

    Yeah, I know I’m ranting, I know it’s super angry, but at this point, I’m done giving a fuck. I’m so fucking tired of hearing corporate videogame site after site, podcast after podcast shit on me and anyone living like me, and claiming I hurt or hold the industry back just because I don’t live or have the same privileges like you people do. There’s a reason why people raged against this, yet you fuckers keep siding with corporations and calling us “crybabies” without really representing our side, so fuck that, and fuck you.

    /Ragetastic rant

    Anyway, good podcast otherwise, loved the top 5, and I do wish you guys could have talked a bit more about project X zone, since that was a game I am very interested in, but oh well. Despite my ranting know that I enjoy the podcast a lot, and will keep listening no matter how much I sometimes might but heads with some of what you say 😛

    1. Totally agree with you, I nearly had to turn the thing off because I was getting so angry with what Chris was saying.

    2. I’ll be honest, I feel like he deserves a punch in the gut sometimes, but he does do six podcasts, puts together trailers, manages 2 sites and keeps up on wrestling, comics, movies, T.V. and games from the past 25 years. If anyone has the right to be a stingy turd-fuck, it’s him. But I will say he has to shut the fuck up about Capcom at SOME point. I don’t want to hear about Remember Me for 14 consecutive episodes only to buy it and realize that it’s raw dog ass. Bah. I should stop bitching.

      1. Keep in mind, I’m not saying Chris is a terrible guy, or that I don’t like him anymore. He’s always fun to listen to- But yeah, he sometimes seems to just talk right up his ass. And most of all, it just irks me that he doesn’t seem to have any true principles or convictions that he’s willing to stand up for, and switches them depending on the side he’s on or what he’s convenient for him. And in no episode is this more clear than here. Every single thing he said in defence of DRM goes against everything he stood for two years, or even one year ago, and that just feels fake to me.

        I mean, say whatever you will about Brett’s or Henry’s Pigheadedness, but at least those guys always stand up for what they believe even if it goes against the companies they work for.

        Ranting aside though, i still acknowledge he’s a great guy to listen to, and that he DOES work his ass off for this site. Definitely not abandoning the shows, but just wanted to vent because I am pretty fucking tired of being called a retrograde, a thief, or a crybaby just because I don’t like what the industry is trying to force on us. Also, please fucking stop saying that we’re not ready for “the future”, that’s a huge pile of bullshit buzzwords, is what it is.

    3. Chris’s ignorance in this episode is extraordinary. I cannot believe how dismissive he was of people in the military wanting to play games during down time. Video games are often a form of stress relief, and if anyone deserves stress relief, it’s soldiers.

      1. Chris didn’t say sedvicepeople shouldn’t play games, nor did Microsoft say anyone shouldn’t play games. They both said some people wouldn’t be able to play games on this particular system, which is entirely reasonable. I think they should have stuck to their plans and released a system that couldn’t be played by everyone, but might have had some features that made it better for whoever could use it. I haven’t heard anything that says that anything they wanted to do couldn’t be done on a PS4, though, without the DRM hassles Microsoft seemed to want to add.

        Chris definitely sounded more corporate in this episode, with almost every issue he piped in on. Mikel sounded like he was trying to say that Microsoft never showed that anything they were trying to push as a benefit of always being connected was exclusive to their system, or needed to lock out features just because they aren’t always online now, but Chris seemed to be pushing the idea that Microsoft needs to be in control all the time to get any new benefits from the new systems.

        1. What I was trying to say was that Microsoft never made a strong case that there was any upside to its DRM plans until the plug was pulled on them. And yes, apart from installing and sharing disc-based games, I don’t understand why it has to cancel these features outright instead of simply applying them to digital games.

          Also, for the record, I’m pretty sure Chris never intended to call anyone a retrograde, a crybaby, or a thief. He liked what Microsoft was selling and is upset that he’s not going to get those features now. He wasn’t championing DRM so much as the features that would’ve come with the DRM. That’s all.

          1. Okay, to be fair, my “being called retrograde, crybaby or thief” was a generalization of the things that most of sites, comments or podcasts have been made lately that criticize the people like me who made such a huge deal about this.

            And while Chris may not have outright called people like me retrograde or crybabies, it’s pretty much implied that’s what he think of people like us, when he says that he wanted all of those features, but now he won’t because “all of the people that took this as the worst case scenario possible.”

            I hope that at least it’s clear what I0m trying to get across? you don’t have to outright say the name of someone or something in order to make an accusation.

        2. Typically if you want to stay afloat in business you appeal the majority, not the minority who have easier access to you product.
          Most of antistas argument was
          “I want this just cause I want this and can easily follow the requirements”
          Oh boy clap clap clap for tyler and chris, they have strong internet and prefer digital.

      2. I kinda don’t have a problem with being dismissive.

        You’re talking about taking a system designed to be used by millions of people and setting policies for it that take into account a group that makes up maybe a few thousand. That’s like a 10th of a percent of the consoles user base.

        I especially love the “Well what about people on submarines” argument. As if MS is seriously supposed to design their console around something that effects, like, 50 people on the planet.

        It’s bullshit. It’s people who are against the policy grasping for an example that you’re not allowed to be dismissive of.

        “Oh, I don’t like this, but, oh, it’s not good for the military. So you can’t support it, cause then you’re against the troops! Ha!”

        1. I’m going to turn your argument against you. Because the problem is that the person above, and anyone bringing up only the military and people living in the boonies, are idiots that apparently aren’t aware that there’s an entire bigger world outside the borders of the US.

          News flash: The majority of the world doesn’t live in the US, what’s more, the majority of the world doesn’t live in first world countries. And before you say that those people people aren’t customers to begin with, you’re wrong. There’s an entire market for games in not just Mexico, but the rest of Latin and south American, and guess what? most of those people MIGHT have Internet, but they don’t have it good or stable enough to properly play an always online console as the Xbone. Lot of eastern countries, places that represent actually millions of potential customers, don’t actually have the requirements the Xbone demands. So no, it’s not just a dismiss-able number.

          1. And guess what, most of those places don’t by Xboxes either, and never have.

            So, again, why should MS be designing their console around people who aren’t their audience?

          2. …And who are you to say they don’t? I live in one such place, and the market for consoles like these is NOT small here. Again, it’s as if you hadn’t listened, Mexico, Argentina, Brazil, and all of latin america, and other countries of more or less the same economic strata in europe all fall in this category, and they DEFINITELY are a market for this. Sure, it’s not as BIG per person as in the US, but all of those in conjunction do contribute a significant profit margin.

            Also, you say “why should Microsoft design their console with the minority in mind”. But then, when Microsoft changes their policies based on what the majority of people asked and wanted, you whine and say it affects you, so I in turn will say. “why should WE, the obvious vocal majority that wanted this change, care about the clearly vocal minority that wanted this?”

            If you’re going to be such an asshole and dismissive of others, or minorities, you’re just forgetting that in this scenario, you and Chris ARE among the minority… So yeah, you’re tasting what that feels like now. The majority of people even in the US apparently wanted this change, so screw you guys. That’s how it works in your mind at least, no? ; )

    4. I’m a big fan of rants, so let me address yo’ criticism 🙂

      1. DRM has become an dirty word because, more often than not, the only time you hear about it is when it goes horribly wrong. But that doesn’t necessarily make it evil. Every time you log into Steam, iTunes, Comixology, etc., you are engaging in an act of Digital Rights Management and consoles still exist primarily to protect IP by restricting what you can do with them. Why would so many willingly accept DRM? Simple: Convenience! And I think it’s a worthy trade off. However, it becomes a news story when said DRM penalizes “legitimate” users in order to deter ne’er-do-wells (I don’t think I need to come up with examples.) When it becomes inconvenient, people complain, and rightly so.

      2. Perhaps my opinion has changed in regards to certain things, but I assure you that has more to do with working at PC Gamer than for a publisher. Steam is the greatest game platform in the world. Good for publishers, good for players (MOST IMPORTANTLY!), and the perfect example of how a service can protect its IP and engage in “horrid” and “scary” acts of “filthy DRM” without ever inhibiting the user experience.

      3. Okay, I have very little defense here: I sounded like an asshole. But please understand, I don’t get to sound off my opinion everyday anymore. So not only was I a little taken aback by the response to Xbone (over features I legitimately thought were exciting), I was somewhat disgusted by the mob mentality exhibited on the internet as everyone quickly dog piled the absolute depth of doom and gloom thinking. Everybody reveled in the absolute worst case scenario, and ignored every single forward thinking piece of futuristic potential such a service could offer.

      While I sympathize with folks who can’t take advantage of a constant internet connection (and unless all of the feedback was sent by mail, I imagine 90% of the detractors are in a position to take advantage) I honestly loathe the idea of holding back new technology purely for the sake of the extreme minority who aren’t connected. Did we protest the release of the iPhone because most of the country lacked data services? We didn’t and the infrastructure grew as a result of the demand for the hardware.

      You prefer used/physical games? Seriously, that’s cool and I get it. But get used to continue paying $60 or more for new games when you could have them for significantly less.

      4. You seriously need proof of The Cloud? Enable it on your iPhone or share data between your PS3 and Vita, play a game on Onlive. I understand if you dont use it, but that doesn’t mean it isn’t there. Ask anyone who does and you’ll probably hear a different story. The Cloud may be a slightly annoying buzzword, I’ll give you that, but it only has one limitation: bandwidth. It can only get better, and the more it gets adopted the more places internet services will provide it, and probably at more competitive prices the longer giant ISPs drag their heels. Or rather, the consumer benefits and progress marches on!

      Furthermore, it means the end of console limitations. While it may currently being used primarily for data backup, it absolutely has the potential to perform amazing feats of processing, the like of which PC gamers have long held aloft over console gamers’ heads. I implore you to not ignore its potential.

      Oh, and in case you think I drank the Microsoft Kool-Aid, like I said on the show, they didn’t really offer any.

      5. Lastly, I honestly feel like shit for sounding like a privileged douchebag. I don’t feel like one, not like some exceptional person with luxuries the rest of the country doesn’t have (even though that’s probably the case.) I’m nothing more than sub middle class and living in a big city with a stable online connection. So while internet and a $500 console every 5 years doesn’t feel like a crazy luxury anymore, even though it may very well be, I can help but fight for the future.

      1. Hey! got a response form the man itself! Before anything else, thank you for taking the time of reading and addressing my rant, and not shrug it off like just another silly Internet user rage XD

        1.- The problem I have when you compare the DRM used by Steam, Comixology, or I-tunes to what Microsoft was trying to implement. Is that it really isn’t the same. For starters, services like steam and Comixology, exist in an environment in which they have several competitors, and people using a PC have several other options if they don’t like those provided. Don’t like steam for some reason? you can go to GOG. Com, buy from the developer themselves, or even go to Origin. Also, those services you guys yourselves said that it took a WHILE before they actually became good and convenient, and that at first they were severally lacking. But again, that was acceptable because you have other options within the same hardware.

        In contrast, Microsoft wouldn’t have ANY distribution competitors within their own console. Had the Xbone kept it’s DRM measures, you’re forcing not just everyone that wants to use the online service, but anyone that simply wanted to play games to adapt to something they didn’t even need or want. Microsoft didn’t give any other option, it was basically “oh, you want my console? then either submit to my DRM measures, or get a 360, or get another system altogether. And all of this in favor of an untested service that we had no guarantee it would work well from the get go. You say DRM is only known for the cases in which goes horribly wrong… Well, part of that is because in the most famous cases, it went wrong RIGHT from the get go. Who can guarantee that the Xbone wouldn’t have just crashed and have been an unusable mess for the first weeks?

        And that’s the thing, Microsoft couldn’t prove anything, they didn’t have a middle ground. It was forcing EVERYONE, not just you, into adopting very radical differences from what the precessing hardware demanded, and while it did offer advantages, let’s be real, they weren’t that many, or at least, not very evident. You mentioned the I-phone and I-tunes, think how unfair the comparison was. The I-phone had NO predecessor, it was a new device and a new brand, and it offered radically new and different features that made people WANT the device because it was immediately evident how many sweet things it could do here that no one else could. That wasn’t the case with the Xbone, none of what they shown concerned DRM was or felt game changing, and even the console itself didn’t do anything super awesome, and even the mandatory Kinect is, right now, a bunch of promises that for all we know could end up being complete BS.

        So again… Why exactly did you expect to trust Microsoft with this?

        2.- One last thing about Steam, one of the reasons Steam is so great for everyone, is because they had to beatdirect, immediate competition. Do you honestly, truly believe Microsoft would have even ATTEMPTED to have a service jsut as good without any direct competition. Tell me honestly, doesn’t it sound far more likely that it would turn out more like Origin or worse? And then again, you have proof right now, the XBLA service for 360. How do you expect us to thrust Microsoft when it’s online service is so many years behind Steam in terms of prices and perks?

        3.- Thing is, it’s not just a minority Chris. You talk only about the ones that have no internet at all. But what about anyone that doesn’t live in a 1st world country? It’s not just about having internet, it’s about having a STABLE internet. It’s also about the fact that pricing here and anywhere that isn’t the US are very different, in Mexico alone games are 150 dollars more expensive in average than in the US. And unlike the US, the price doesn’t radically go down in a couple months, years can pass and price would have dropped only 10 bucks for most cases. Also, in here and most other countries, we don’t have a behemoth like gamestop, there’s still a lot of small brick and mortar stores that actually make very fair game trades. So for us it’s not just the always online thing, used games ARE a big deal and a much more economic way to get games than in the US.

        4.- Okay, from the examples you gave me, I still don’t see why your system needs to be always online for it to be used? SO whatever potential the Cloud has, we could still see it in the consoles as it is. As far as I understand it at least.

        5.- And well Chris, again, if you really want to “fight” for the future, then why not adopt a high end PC? again, that has all the features you miss now on the Xbone, but in much better, powerful, flexible hardware and software. thinking it better… why would you ever want an Xbone if a much better provider for what you want is readily available for just a couple hundred bucks extra?

      2. This wasn’t holding back technology for people like me, without a decent internet connection, It was forcing people who couldn’t use it and taking away rights in the process. No one said you cant download games, just give the option for physical, without internet.

        Do you really think family sharing wasn’t going to have huge restrictions like time limits. The same companies complaining about used games are really gonna risk 90% of their sales?

        As a programmer I can tell you most games aren’t going to use the cloud for computation, It would most likely be used for dynamic servers, which cool, isn’t some life changing technology that needs to be forced on people.

  19. I was always going to get both systems because I know eventually there will be some games on the Xbone that I want to play (aka Titan Fall!). However this DRM reversal has definitely made it easier for me to justify the price tag of the system. This DRM and 24 hr online check in was a real big issue in my country (New Zealand) as our internet is uber slow compared to the rest of the world and we still have data caps!!! Its good to see someone realize there are gamers out there on small remote islands such as mine : )

  20. Oh! and one more thing about Chris’s incredibly idiotic tirade: “Why can’t I have my premium experience?”

    Who says you can’t? If you’re that willing and eager to dish out a lot of money for a “premium” experience, why not get a fucking high end PC with HDMI port so you can plug it into your HD TV? PC has all the shit you want, it has mainly digital only distribution, steam is gonna integrate game-sharing soon, and if your fantabulous “power of the could” is gonna be properly used, it’s probably gonna be on PC first.

    So there, if you’re going to act like such an entitled, privileged asshole, at least fucking do it properly and go all the way.

    1. I think his main argument is simply that he wanted the two consoles to be different, so that there was actually a choice for people to make.

      MS was doing something completely new and different. If you wanted that experience, you could get an XB1. If you didn’t, you could get a PS4.

      Now, both consoles are functionally identical. And people no longer have the choice of how they want their gaming experience to be.

      And that’s too bad. I wasn’t going to get an XB1 the way it was, but for the people that were, it’s sad that their option was taken away from them by an audience that demands EVERYTHING be the way they want it, not just some things.

      1. Except MS wasn’t really doing something new and different, as I said, everything they were attempting to do has or is being done by PCs, only better.

        Also, even if the processor is essentially the same, doesn’t mean the consoles are identical at all. And even now they have very palpable differences both in features and vision. Xbone is pushing still for motion and voice controls and making them obligatory for the system, they are focusing on appealing more to the casual with streaming and TV services, and their offering of exclusives IS significant enough to make a difference.

        Yes, they WERE going to be even more different, but evidently, Microsoft saw that going that route would have put them on the losing side, and rightfully so. Being different for the sake of being different isn’t enough, they have to be GOOD differences. And Microsoft didn’t prove or earn enough trust to justify the changes they were making.

        And anyway, as it stands, it does good for both consoles to be similar in this way, it means a much more direct competition which is what results in creating better features on each of their part to try and out-best the other. Because, if you’re TOO different, you no longer become direct competition and you no longer feel threatened by it, and the Wii U is a perfect example of this. No one feels like they are directly competing with Nintendo, so neither Nintendo nor the other consoles feel the need to best one another.

        1. And I’m kinda completely okay with that. The Ninendo audience has now practically become completely separate from the MS/PS audience, and I’m pretty much okay with those people having their own system.

          Likewise, it’s obvious that the audience MS wanted for the XB1 was the bro-gamer and their families. The Call of Duty/Halo/Madden/ crowd.

          I’m not one of those gamers, but I have absolutely no problem with a company deciding they want to design their system around those gamers. I’ll just get a different system that’s more aimed at me.

          Not everything has to be designed FOR me. As long as SOMETHING is, then I’m completely okay with OTHER things being designed for OTHER people.

          But that’s not okay for some people apparenlty. Even though the PS4 is everything they want, they insist that the XB1 ALSO has to be everything they want. Whatever.

          Sorry brogamers. I was looking forward to you all being on a different system than me. Guess that’s not gonna happen now.

          1. Aaaaand you missed the point completely, congratulations.

            Nobody said they wanted the same thing, and they AREN’T the same thing. But they are close enough to compete directly, and that’s a GOOD THING. Competition drives improvement, and the harsher and closer the competition, the better for the consumer.

            That is precisely the kind of thing that made steam so beloved by everybody. Steam became what it is, because it had competition it needed to beat. Heck, the PS3 became a MUCH better system later down the line because the competition in the 360 kicked it’s ass, and punished their hubris, and anti-consumer policies. Now the PS3 is a much better system for it.

            The same thing is what happened here. Microsoft thought they could do what they wanted, and among other things, it was Sony who put the fucking brakes on them.With both systems keeping the other in check, it’s more likely we’ll get benefited as consumers overall, without getting raped by the companies in the process.

            And obviously, if Microsoft changed it’s mind, it’s because it was clear for them that the console they were designing wasn’t gonna be of the taste of even most of their target audience. Which is why they changed it. So don’t worry, either way, Microsoft didn’t do things thinking of you, you can rest easy on that 😛

          2. Bleh, it won’t let me reply to the post in the other chain because it’s too far down the pyramid I guess.

            As far as “Who am I to say they don’t” goes, I’m someone that actually reads the sales numbers. And the Playstation 3 outsells the the 360 by a wide margin in every place but NA.

            P.S. Putting a winking face after being a smug shit-head doesn’t make you any less of a smug shit-head. Anyone who’s been using the internet for more that a month knows that trick.

          3. Who said I wanted to be less of a smug shit head? ; )

            And there you go, any place that buys PS3 units is a market that is interested in a game console, and is STILL a potential market for Microsoft. Just because the PS3 outsells the 360 everywhere els in the world, doesn’t mean that Microsoft couldn’t try to appeal to them and steal that market for the PS3, after all, that’s what they did in the US.

            But fine, i get your point. Microsoft maybe IS mainly just interested in the US and high end areas. Only problem is… Apparently those people they were aiming for, most didn’t either get, or like the product they were being pitched…

          4. True enough. I think MS was simply banking on the brogamer either not being informed enough or not caring in the first place to take issue with the changes they wanted to make.

            Either they were just mistaken, or the gamer community did a better than expected job of getting the word out.

          5. Glad we can finally agree on something XD

            And well, i think it was a combination of both? I get the impression that they genuinely believed that people would just sit back and gobble up whatever they offered. Which seems to be the frequent pitfall companies end falling into with these kinds of things.

            Kinda like Iwata being surprised that the 3DS wasn’t selling like hot pancakes after the first 2-3 months of the console coming out eve though the console didn’t offer any good games back then. He said something along the lines of “I genuinely thought fans would be picking these off the shelves left and right.”

            In conclusion: Companies are stupid XD

  21. QOTW: It didn’t change my opinion at all. I was on board with the newer policies and the family sharing possibility since my friends aren’t close to me anymore and thus I can’t physically trade games anymore. Family sharing would have allowed that. As it stands everything stays the same but I get all the benefits of the X1 which I’m fine with.

    The X1 continues to get a lot of flack (it is the cool internet thing to do after all) but it will be a great console. Lot of new features such as snap mode and game dvr plus true next gen gaming possibilities with kinect 2. the 100$ extra cost will be hammered on over and over but in this day and age, it is pretty clear people will pay for the added value so MS has to really market all these extra features.

  22. That Tron area of Disneyland (actually next door at the DIsney California Adventure park) was called ElecTronica, it was the most glorious, amazing thing while it existed (but is gone now of course). I spent a LOT of time there. Man it would have been awesome to party with you guys there! The highlights:

    –An crazy, cheezy, astounding opening stage dance show which was a salute to the 80s and Tron Legacy
    –A replica of Flynn’s Arcade, with about 50 classic arcade games including Space Paranoids, special Flynn’s tokens, 80’s songs playing loudly, and out-of-order sighs that looked like they were printed with Print Shop on a dot-matrix printer.
    -Nightly competitions with the Tron Evolution home games.
    -A DJ dance area featuring Eckert (a clone of Michael Sheen’s Castor), go-go cage dancers and sexy sirens.
    -An End of Line club that served damn strong glowing drinks, knocked me on my arse more than once!

    It was where I discovered how much fun it is to get drunk and go dancing at Disneyland, and then try to play Zaxxon,. Seems really subversive somehow! They do still have a club there called the Mad-T party, based on a psycho Alice in Wonderland theme. It’s actually really cheesy-cool too, but it’s definitely not the same as ElecTronica, always hope they bring it back someday if there’s another movie.

  23. 1. There is no guarantee that an all-digital console would suddenly have all sorts of magical awesome deals on games. In fact there is nothing to indicate that Microsoft would do such a thing.

    2. Friend sharing aside there is nothing you cannot do on Xbone or PS4 now, after the change, that you couldn’t do on the Xbone before they announced these recent changes. The digital future is still here, but at least now it’s a CHOICE.

    3. The “it doesn’t affect me” argument is perhaps the poorest argument there ever was, for anything :/

  24. Oh yeah, Zangief is absolutely not a villain btw.

    He’s portrayed as one in a lot of 3rd party media simply because 4 villains is usually not enough.

    But in the games, he’s never been a villain. I mean, Christ, in SF4 his motivation for entering the tournament is to impress the children of Russia.

    The UDON comic, which adheres much closer to the plots and characterizations of the video games than most interpretations, also makes him out to be a good guy.

  25. I feel so bad for Zangief. In SFxT he gets locked out of the space shuttle and dragged into orbit. I think he died. Is this canon? RIP guy.

    QOTW: These features never affected me and by the time I purchase a new console in spring or summer of 2014, it will be a whole ‘nother story. As this next generation ages, I feel like these features will creep back in until we just accept it as commonplace. I want to embrace the future too, it was just too jarring of a change for a lot of people.

  26. I just think it’s moronic that anyone would think I’d buy a system with a built-in failure state which could be triggered by events totally outside of my control. Steam will let me play my games forever, even in offline mode.

  27. *Reads comments*
    So remember how it’s been mentioned that if Kurt Cobain was alive today, he probably would have sold out and become an entitled piece of shit like Metallica or pretty much every other band now? Because I remember Chris Antista mentioning that. Funny, he’s become that very thing.

    Listen- my answer to the QotW is this- now or even after the changes , nothing about the Xbox One appeals to me. I have a full time, 40 hout job, get paid very well and have a steady internet. I however lack space for a Kinect, and since I work in the IT field, have an idea on how “Cloud Computing” works. So the device now and forever lacks any appeal to me. I actually rebought a PS3 (had to sell it for rent before my current job) after Sony’s and Microsoft’s conferences specifically because I like the future Sony went with.

    So my answer to both questions is no. For the TL;DR crowd, my answer is no.

  28. Another great episode!

    As for the question of the week, I feel the main detractor of the Xbox One to me wasn’t really addressed in the episode. Why does Kinect NEED to be connected for the console to function? Can I not play a single player game without it?

    Microsoft is selling this data to advertisers (I work in advertising and yes this stuff happens all the time) and for all we know the NSA (what would they even do with that data?) and this to me is the most blatant violation of consumer rights.

    I could live with the 24 hour check in because I will always have internet (Similar to what Chris said). The used game issue for me was also a big issue, I buy used games when I see them cheap and need something to play, Sure I may not be supporting the developer, but otherwise I would have never even touched the game and when a sequel comes out I would be more inclined to buy it day one based on playing the used version of it.

    Lets also be honest, whatever DRM they include will be hacked to bits within days of release. I really love my 360, The Xbox One games look great too but as long as Kinect needs to watch me I will not be getting the Xbox One.

  29. Honestly, I’m with Chris on this one. It was exciting to see Microsoft try something new and, though I was initially put off by how restrictive the platform seemed, I’m now incredibly underwhelmed by both Microsoft and Sony bragging that we’re getting more of the same.
    I’ll probably just stick with my 360 for a while since I’ve got a huge library and a bit of a back log going. Here’s hoping the free games Microsoft is giving out every 2 weeks get better than Defense Grid…

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